Are you reading this, Forsooth?
"The women's movement needed to address the abuses of power. Nobody would ever challenge that. But in the course of doing that, it had some unanticipated consequences, including attempting to neutralize power in places where power is intrinsic. Such as in desire. An element of aggression or hostility is often part of erotic desire. It's not just joy and contentment. There is another side to desire and it's that that we have become uncomfortable with feeling and expressing. The whole point of fantasy is that it's not meant to be reality. We can experience these feelings very comfortably and playfully with a partner, without fearing, What does it say about me?"
Esther Perel said that in the article Mating in Captivity and I couldn't agree with her more. It also touches on the crux of a philosophical argument I had with Forsooth (all our arguments are philosophical; we've never met. Or, in other words, if a tree falls in the woods...) regarding what is acceptable in the sexual realm. To sum it up (for the umpteenth time), I feel anything goes in a sexual encounter between two consenting adults, while Forsooth is against certain things she perceives to be degrading, such as dirty talking (where the woman is specifically called a pejorative term).
Anyways, this woman made her point very well and it strikes at the heart of everything that I believe about commitment and marriage and carnal relations. Or, how I'm-not-really-a-commitment-phobe-it's-the-world-that's-fucked-up.
posted by Basil Epicurus at 5:26 PM
10 Comments:
It is all fantasy, hence things that would seem degrading in reality become eroticized and a source of pleasure. *shrug* If both are alright with it, why not? Just as long as certain "degrading" things don't translate into reality that is.
it's not fantasy when it's actually happening! and anyway, why would i want any truck with any person who has THOSE fantasies. why should anyone? why should a woman want to be with someone who actually thinks she's whore and wants to sexually humiliate her?
if people are ok with such things, they want their head examined. while the power imbalance remains still hugely in favour of men, and the state, it's not ok. anyway, i thought u said u understood what i was on about?
da gheir inno, what's up your ass? why don't i, and everyone else, have the right to consent to any sexual act? it's the motherfucking law, why can't you just deal with the fact that not everyone wants to be called names and hit, just so some pathetic worm of a man can feel on like he has the smlelest control over his life and some validity as a human being.
What's up YOUR ass? Nothing, right? That's how friggin' uptight you are. I said I understood where you were coming from, that's not to say I agree. Which I don't. Since you're being an asshole about this and dropping names and can't seem to have an adult conversation to save your life, you can just go fuck yourself. And you can be as quiet and polite and respectful as you want, while you're doing it.
No, tool, a fantasy can be lived out, when you pretend it's really happening. It's like seeing a movie: people get killed but....(shhhhhh)...they're not actually dead! You should consult that precious dictionary of yours, instead of extrapolating the balance of human experience based on your own, limited (really, really limited, actually) life.
And by the way, sweeping generalisations? Not an attractive trait in an adult. You my want to lose that if you're planning on any kind of credibility. Just because you don't see it doesn't make it out of bounds, savvy?
i think my response was largely mild and reasoned. i stand by it. read it again. if anyone was offensive, it was you.
you have brought this up a lot of time hence my question about what was up ur ass. big deal ya3nee...do whatever the hell u wanna do, and so will i. it's my right to be offended, and that's what i was saying.
Your definition of mild and reasoned must be different than mine: your first post was fine, the second one went after me.
Secondly, don't tell me how to talk on my own fucking site. Third, read your SECOND set of comments. I've listed them here:
"da gheir inno, what's up your ass?"
"why can't you just deal with the fact that not everyone wants to be called names and hit"
"just so some pathetic worm of a man can feel on like he has the smlelest control over his life and some validity as a human being".
Your problem is you can't have a detached discussion without getting personal. All your comments imply that I'm the pathetic worm who wants to call women names and hit them so my life can have some validity. When that's not what I'm into (not that it's any of your business) and not the point I was making at all. I'm in favor of not judging people based on what they do with a willing partner-END OF STORY. Your S&M fantasies about "hitting" and "calling women degrading names" are something I NEVER brought up. You just assumed them and went off on me.
You don't know me, you don't know what I like and what I don't like and just because I'm in favor of something, doesn't give you a right to call me names because of it.
And lastly, I don't know if you think we have some kind of bond or whatever, but we don't. We're not friends, I've never met you and I don't owe you shit. I didn't overreact; you were obnoxious, insulting and completely out of order. Which you're entitled to be if that's who you are--just don't be surprised when people respond to it with the same.
Look, Forsooth, I appreciate you sent me a personal email expressing your opinion that I overreacted. But if sending me a personal email is your tacit attempt at making peace, putting in words like "your complete craziness and aggression" isn't the way to calm things down.
And I'm saying the same thing here I said in my email back to you: you have a problem recognizing the perjorative shit that you come up with. Which would be fine if you weren't so unbelievably sensitive about the slightest insult-real or perceived.
Look, again, I don't know you and you don't know me so a modicum of respect goes a long way. I may have expressed opinions you don't agree with, but insults and name-calling is no way to garner respect or affection. Bil 3araby, inti wakhda 3alaya awy considering I have no context to place your words. When Carmen calls me an asshole, I know exactly what she means and how she means it, even if she does that in a public forum like a blog. Not that she would: she's mindful of not embarrassing me in public.
I have no idea what you expect when you throw napalm at people like that..
By the way, this is the last time I bring up this, or any other, subject with you. It obviously pushes your buttons way more than I could have even dreamed. I only really brought it up as a philosophical debating point, not to ridicule your POV, as I have to assume you thought my intention was. That's the only way I can explain you blowing up like this.
So yup, last comment and last time I bring anything up.
Go, Basil, Go!!
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